Towing with 2018 Subaru Forester

efelker

We are considering a new T@G Sofitel. We would like to tow with a 2018 Subaru Forester (rated at 1500 lbs). Can anyone tell us what the dry weight of the T@G Sofitel is and also any comments if you are towing with a Forester with the CVT transmission?

Michigan_Mike

We can get this information for you but I would guess that the specs would be very close to the standard T@G trailer as noted below.... I'll send a note on to nuCamp and ask that they provide this information.

GAWR: 2,200 lbs
Tongue Weight (Excluding Spare): 100 lbs
Tongue Weight with LP and Battery: 170 lbs
Total Weight with LP and Battery: 1,046 lbs
Total Weight without Battery and LP: 986 lbs
Roof Vent: 14″ x 14″

AnacortesArmyGuy

I own both a 2015 Subaru Forester and a 2016 Subaru Crosstrek with the CVT. Both are rated for 1500lbs towing, but I use the Crosstrek with its smaller engine for towing our 2017 T@G Max which weighs as Michigan Mike described above. Though the Crosstrek has the smaller of the two engines (2 liter versus the Forester’s 2.5 liter), it performs very well towing the T@G, though I pay close attention to tongue weight and camper loaded weight in accordance with the guidelines Subaru puts in the owner’s manual. I feel the CVT does a great job of pulling the T@G in all of the conditions I’ve driven thus far. This includes interstate, both flat, hilly, as well as over mountain passes here in Washington, and on trips through Idaho and Montana. I probably only have a little over 5,000 miles towing the T@G to date, but I’ve not yet encountered any situation that has made me uneasy. BTW, I do have electric brakes on my T@G and would not pull the T@G without them.

Fourman110

Hmmmm, might want to think about that. The 1500 lbs is a max weight and it doesn’t take a lot of additional items to get there (food, pots, full water tank clothing, etc.). Even under max weight, it’ll pull down mileage (interesting to hear from people on what might leave change they see) and wear on the transmission. There’s quite a bit of info in the outback and forester forums (like subaruoutback.org).

I’ve got a t@g Boondock (Outback) that I tow with an Outback. I’m well under the 2800 lbs tow limit. Only one trip so far but it pulled my mileage down to 16 mpg. While I didn’t have problems accelerating and stopping, rpms were up a bit and it felt a little under powered.

AnacortesArmyGuy

I average 24-26 mpg in the Crosstrek with the T@G, but that is at an average speed of 60 mph or less. With a GVWR of 4343lbs I put most of my cargo in the Crosstrek which is where I have the weight cushion, but then again I am careful about what I bring, then transfer to the camper when I reach my destination. The only things I carry in the camper when I’m towing are bedding, refrigerator contents, and about 25lbs of miscellaneous supplies. I’ve also removed the stock propane tank in favor of a 1lb canister setup as it brings the tongue weight down to a more manageable level and meets Subaru’s guidance of a tongue weight generally being somewhere between 8-12 percent of the trailers gross weight. When I pull it across the scales the T@G is never more than 1100lbs. My Forester has noticeably more oomph than my Crosstrek, so I have no doubt it could handle the T@G without issue as my Crosstrek has proven itself able to do thus far. The key is to be smart as to how you distribute your load and don’t exceed Subaru’s guidelines as outlined in their owner’s manual. One thing I’ve noticed in both the Forester and Crosstrek forums, as well on this site and it’s companion T@B website, there appears to be a number of people who appear willing to push the envelope when it comes to towing as far as weight, brakes/no brakes, etc. It’s kind of scary to think of what may be sharing the road with you.

Creed227

Hello, I too have had questions with towing a Tag Max XL, and I see the response Michigan Mike posted with the weights and I have seen other places give other weights and it can be confusing. Is the weights posted by Mike the most accurate ones? Also with the weight of the tongue with the LP and Battery, does it include the spare tire too? The one weight just has the tongue weight without the spare tire and such I just wanted to verify the true weight or as close as possible of the Tag Max XL with full tank of propane and battery and spare tire. And the next part with those close to accurate weights would a vehicle with a tow capacity of 2,000 lbs tow the Tax Max XL? Thanks for all the responses in advance!

TomD

Generally each camper has different weights based on what is on board. You probably would be well served if you weighed the tounge yourself with all of your own stuff. The process is simple and can be done with a home scale. The following link will take you to one of the most common methods. Maybe others on this forum have other means and can chime in.
http://hildstrom.com/projects/tonguescale/

LuckyJ

Tongue weight is something that will vary depending on how you load your trailer, if the water thank is full, half full or empty, how much stuff you have in the gally, how much stuff you have in what we call the basement (underbed storage compartiment and where in thos compatiment you have place the load), how much stuff you transport in the TD from one location to an other and how you llace that load in the TD, toward the front, the back of the middle. In short, it is easy to overload the tongue, but it is also easy to underload the tongue, but finaly, easy to have it balance.

As for towing with your Forester with a 2000lbs towing capacity, yes you can do it in my mind, but again, it will be easy to overload and pass that towing limit. Don't forget that the towing limit of a vehicule in calculated with the load that you also carry in your car.

Since you are close from the towing limit, I would go with trailer brakes and brake controler on the car.

And then, you will have comment coming that to be safe, you should be towing with a 5 000 lbs towing capacity vehicule cause it is extremely dangerous to tow near the limit of your load capacity. It could be true if you are the tupe of driver that want to go 80 mph and follow only a few feet from the the vehicule in front of you.

In my book, when towing a trailer, specialy near the towing limit of your vehicule, you must slow down and at least double the 2 sec distance (yep, now 4 sec) from the vehicule in front of you. And remember, your are on vacation, so you should not be in a hurry, if you are, stick to motels and hotels.

nmmike

I used to own a Forester with the CVT, and am now towing a 2017 six wide Rough Rider with a v6 2006 Tacoma with tow package and electric brakes. The Tacoma is rate at 6500 lbs towing capacity and fully loaded I am at less than half that. However, I would never think about towing this trailer or anything weighing close to it with a Forester. I wouldn't tow anything larger than a MyPod with the Forester and be comfortable about saftey and the life of the CVT and warranty issues.

LuckyJ

TV with CVT are not the best of vehicules to tow a trailer with. Those trany are well known for efficiency and fuel economie, but not durability under constant heavy load. And they do not provide good compression braking.

But manufacturer already plan for a fudge factor in tow rating. So unless you want to tow like the trailer is not behind you, if you are under tow rating, you will be fine legaly and physicaly. But again, I insist about the fact that you have to be aware and remember that it is behind you and plan for it, cause even towing with something like a tacoma with double the weight capacity, it can still kick you and since you were not expecting it, it can be even worst when you get caught off guard.

That is only my opinion.

And as I am writing this, I remember that I was wondering why I could not bring that loaded 1/2 ton ford econoline back in the middle of the road that was swaing like crazy, until I saw that I had a trailer in the back with yard tractor in it. Load was very well balance, but I was on ice with a side wind. Once I saw the trailer in my rear view mirror, I slowed down and pulled it back and kept on driving........ But slower. That was 30 years ago. Never happen since then.

Oh boy, how did I became so old so fast.

LuckyJ

@nmmike i have a question, forget about towing capacity spec, how can you feel safe towing an announce 6000 # load with a 4500 # véhicule. this is what is announce with toyota specs.

So with this, I feel much more confortable towing a 1000 # trailer with a 1500 # capacity on a 3200# vehicule that is full time awd on top of that.

This is just a reflexion based on manufacturer specifications.

nmmike

LuckyJ
I would not feel good towing 6000 lbs with the Taco, although I have not done it,
based on towing approx 2500 lbs , I don't think I would want to be towing more
than 3000-3500 lbs, just my guess,, especially in mountains, for a long trip

LuckyJ

@nmmike said:
LuckyJ
I would not feel good towing 6000 lbs with the Taco, although I have not done it,
based on towing approx 2500 lbs , I don't think I would want to be towing more
than 3000-3500 lbs, just my guess,, especially in mountains, for a long trip

I would not be confortable either, at full manufactured approuved load, but even with 3000-3500, you are still above the proportion of the suby of this topic. And I am not talking about approuved load, but about vehicule stability.

I am trying to point out that we are still within manufac. Load range limit. So in either case, legality is not an issues. But be confortable with a load is. And at one point, keep the same proportion, and theire is no problems. But start getting close and above the same weight to the TV, and things can start going south fast.

I know for a fact, that dot officier around here would like to see inspection on now 1/2 ton pick up truck, cause entrepreneurs have begun using them as transport vehicule for heavy fifth wheel flat ed trailers, cause with the new weight capacity that the manufac give them, less are purchasing hd pick-up that needed to past yearly dot inspection. Lighter truck, no inspections, and legaly overloaded.

I do travel with my jeep and a trailer loaded with firewood that is very close and maybe just a tab above the weight capacity of my unlimited TJ (3500 lbd capacity), I drive 100 miles of highway, with long up and down hill that will make a tractor trailer crawl for up to 15 minutes at a time, but I slow down and never push it. And with a well balance load, even in emergency manoeuvers, never came close to loose comtrol.

I agree, we have to tell people to be carrfull when we they reach or get close to the load limit of their TV, but who are we to tell them not to do it or mention that "I would not do it".
'Simply tell them that I did it in the past, and for any reason " mention experience that happen and how it happen" I have decided to purchase a higher cap... TV. If you had a overheating issue, a tranny problem, tell it. If it is because I am just plain scared of what could happen ( and I am not saying I am) can we just keep it to ourself.

But we have to informd them that they have to stay below the manufac limit of their TV, and tell them that they will not be able to drive like thay do not have a trailer behind, and that is no matter what they are pulling.

An other example I saw on a world wide known expedition forum, a topic had been started about TV load capacity, that was saying that no one should tow a trailer w/o using at least a 1 ton pich up and if it was a more that 30 ft, go with a 5/4 and even 6/4 if not more. The exemple that was given is about a guy the ad lost everything after an accident at high speed while towing a trailer. After many pages of back and forth, we found out that the guy was pulling a toyhauler traler that was like 40 ft, with six wheels, that had a buggy loaded in the back and had lost controle after meeting a tractor trailer in a windy day at 80 plus miles per hours cause he was always in a hurry to reach his playland destination on friday evening after work. Dang! Come on!

Our job here is to informe, and bring awarness to people that no matter what they tow with ( load cap being respected) , above all, that they have to behave.

Luc

Brian

Well said, Luc. I hope folks pay special attention to your last sentence.

MjL

On the subject of towing. I have a '17 tag max no microwave and live in Denver CO. I have been over Vail And Loveland passes (both Continental divide high altitude). I am towing with a 2014 Subaru Crosstrek XV. I am only able to get to 45-50mph over the high mountain passes. It has a CVT transmission and 2.0L engine. For two years that has been ok because the scenery is awesome. Just got back from a trip to Oregon going through northern Utah, Nevada and the car wouldn't get out of third gear in the dessert. Had to pull over to let transmission cool down many times. My question is, does anyone have input(in a nice way), on Subaru Outback 2.5L with CVT trans. pulling big hills without trouble? Would love some help.

TomD

Mil..checkout the following link. I is one of many. https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/Discussion-d380_ds847412

Scotty49

I found the same problem when towing our 2018 TAG XL with my 2015 Crosstrek from Phoenix to Flagstaff up I-17. I chose to change our TV to a 2015 Xterra. In retrospect, the Crosstek would have likely performed better if it had been equipped with a turbocharger. The good news ..... Many people on this forum have commented favorably on towing TAGs with Subaru Outbacks.

OutdoorEd

We pulled our T@G Max w/an Outback 2.5i for 1 1/2 seasons. My only concerns were the higher, longer climbs and accelerating onto highways. On longer climbs up steeper grades, I typically drove at about 60, but the engine strained. Smaller mountains, hills and flats, you could scarcely tell the T@G was back there.

We recently traded the 2.5i for a 3.6R and it made a tremendous difference. Our first trip out involved a 5 mile 7% grade (which is pretty long and steep by highway standards. Loveland is 6%) and it took it at 70 MPH at 1000-1500 rpm less than the 2.5i did at 60 MPH on the same mtn. So, there's that. Oh, btw, the sixer is way quieter in terms of road noise, more like a high-end luxury sedan.

BBsGarage

The CVT is not a good choice for towing to start with, add the high altitudes and climbs and you're really pushing the limits of the drive train. The 6 cylinder has a more standard transmission, not the CVT. Our 2012 Outback with the 6 tows like the camper is not even there.

Martog

@BBsGarage said:
The CVT is not a good choice for towing to start with, add the high altitudes and climbs and you're really pushing the limits of the drive train. The 6 cylinder has a more standard transmission, not the CVT. Our 2012 Outback with the 6 tows like the camper is not even there.

Is it the older OB's that have the more standard transmission on the 3.6? The current 2019 models use the same CVT in the 2.5 according to Subaru's website.

I'll be honest, I love my OB and I would get another in a heartbeat. I don't ever plan on towing anything overly large (I'm looking at a T@G XL) and I have a PWC trailer for a single water craft I tow just fine. Though I think that total weight is less than the T@G is.

WilliamA

Not to make things more complex but as I've noted before in other threads, many owners manuals give the gross weight of trailers and also have the maximum cross-section of the trailer listed in square feet. Pulling a trailer isn't just about weight. A small trailer loaded with anvils may be easier on your car than one full of cotton balls that has the frontal cross-section of a semi. Weight matters taking off and going up hills, but cross-section is there ever inch of the trip. Don't be fooled by the folks who say the tow vehicle will "cut" the wind. That's not the case, aerodynamically. It will cut "some" of the wind, but turbulence around the vehicle can actually make the frontal drag from the trailer worse.
On the subject of CVT's, as a lifelong mechanic, well, I'll wait and see how they perform before I jump on one. Many folks also don't understand that transmission heat is the killer of both transmissions and engines. Transmission heat must be shed through the radiator on many cars, heating up the engine cooling system. The transmission cooler is often buried within the radiator so any heat made by the transmission will necessarily add heat to the engine. Most tow vehicle transmissions die from overheat, not underpower.
WilliamA

MjL

Thanks everyone for your input! I have been very impressed with the performance of my CVT as a veteran mechanic and learned from experience this newer design contraption, (remembering what cars used to be like). My Crosstrek has been great on Loveland, Vail, Fremont, and other passes in Colorado. Also driving through the mountains of northern Cal. and Oregon had normal behavior. I think the heat of the Nevada and Utah desserts along with the vehicle created the condition.
I do again say thanks and appreciate the input from this family Teardroppers and continue to wait for the new food group too, WilliamA.
Peace