Need advice upgrading battery charger

RodneyHelenchild

Does anyone have any advice regarding upgrade of battery charger. I would like to add a three stage charger and am not sure how to install it. I am not an electrician but I follow instructions well. Do I have to disable the factory installed charger? If anyone has upgraded with a new charger where is it placed? I appreciate any advice that anyone can give. Thanks in advance.

LuckyJ

The dealer where you got the charger from should be able to help you with this.

Michigan_Mike

@RodneyHelenchild said:
Does anyone have any advice regarding upgrade of battery charger. I would like to add a three stage charger and am not sure how to install it. I am not an electrician but I follow instructions well. Do I have to disable the factory installed charger? If anyone has upgraded with a new charger where is it placed? I appreciate any advice that anyone can give. Thanks in advance.

Is there any particular reason you want to do this (e.g., is the battery dying or discharging quickly, etc.)? The electric converter on your trailer charges the battery when you plug the trailer in to shore power and floats the charge. If you do this a few times a month you shouldn't have any issues as it's not a good idea to keep the trailer plugged into shore power full time as it adds wear and tear to the electric converter.

Have you considered just using a battery tender when the trailer is parked? If it were me, I would buy a Zamp solar port connector, install it close to the battery and then use a battery tender to charge the battery. The only thing you would have to do here is reverse the connections to the battery from the Zamp connector (when attaching it to the battery) because the polarity is opposite of what it is on the battery tender. In other words the battery tender will not work correctly and will not allow the battery to be charged. I found this out when I first got into teardrop trailers and accidentally tossed a battery tender into the garbage because I wasn't aware of the Zamp connector issue. Zamp wires their solar panels and ports this way to ensure safety for users.

But I will add here that by using a quick disconnect setup for the battery to allow it to easily charge and to float the charge when the trailer is sitting idle, this is an easy and efficient way to keep the battery fully charged if you are unable to isolate the battery from the trailer wiring via an on/off battery switch. Some of the earlier trailers didn't have the switch and with LED lights, stereo systems, TV, etc. these items will drain the battery quickly via parasitic drain when the trailer is sitting in your driveway. This is why it's important to isolate the battery after it is fully charged. Batteries DO discharge some over time on their own when idle, but this process takes time and eliminating or isolating trailer components will eliminate and minimize parasitic battery drain.

I use a battery tender with the quick disconnects on my lawn tractors and leave them on the tender over the winter here in Michigan when I travel to Arizona and when I get home, I fire up the lawn tractor and it starts right up because the battery is fully charged. We have one on my wife's car too when we leave and no problems encountered when we return.

RodneyHelenchild

Thanks for these replies. I had the impression from reading other posts that a three stage charger was an important upgrade if I wanted to maximize the life of my battery and that the charger converter that came with my T@g was not very good quality. So far I have not had problems with my battery but I want to be proactive. I would like to add solar to my system this summer as we do not want to be restricted only to those campgrounds that have electric sites. Do you have a recommendation for a particular battery tender or are most of them good quality?

Rodney Helenchild

Sharon_is_SAM

Can’t go wrong with a smart charger by Deltran - Battery Tender or Noco. Consider if you will upgrade to a larger / different kind of battery in your future with solar. Some tenders may be better for AGMs vs wet cell batteries.

https://rvside.com/best-deep-cycle-battery-charger-reviews/

Jason_C

I have owned my 2019 Tag for almost a year now. It is really designed to be plugged in to a 120v outlet while camping. There are some limitations in the design and components that make it less than ideal for Boondocking or camping off the grid. I am also trying to overcome these shortfalls without blowing the budget.
Here are some of the hurdles to overcome:
1. Battery Charging - yes the Tag was a built in battery charger that comes on automatically to charge the battery when the camper is plugged in to 110-120 volt outlet. My Tag Battery Charger was working fine until recently. Now the fuse trips when the charger comes on to charge the battery when it has low voltage. I currently have appointment scheduled with service dept to trouble shoot the problem. I suspect it is a problem with the converter itself or the battery. I am also working to isolate the problem.
So the TAG does not actually have a DC charger, meaning that your Tag Battery will not re-charge while driving, or only recharge at a very very low rate. A DC battery charger will correct this issue because it will send a higher charge/ amp current to the battery to actually CHARGE it. (A drained battery has no DRAW so it will not pull substanstial current from the Tow Vehicle). My experience shows that it may take over 20 hours of driving to recharge a drained battery on the camper.
2. Parasitic Draws - as mentioned by Michigan Mike. Those are the other draws.
3. The Norcold Refrig that comes installed from the factory is not conducive to battery operation. (Norcold refrig draw a lot of amps). There are other refrig models that will run at least 3 times longer on the same amount of battery amp/hrs.
4. The ceiling fan is oversized for the unit and drain battery quickly.
5. When the camper is plugged into the towed vehicle, it draws power from both the camper battery and the vehicle battery, UNLESS you turn off the Battery shut-off. Once you turn off battery shut-off in the battery box, your vehicle is no longer sending ANY power to the camper battery.
6. You have to have some life in the camper battery to run the stove in the kitchen. There is a safety switch that prevents stove from working if rear hatch to camper is closed.
7. Don't leave your camper plugged (7 pin rv plug) into your Tow Vehicle while boondocking. Your camper with drawer from your car battery unless you install low voltage isolator switch.

So if you want to camp at non-electric sites for more than one night in the summer, there are 2 courses of action, equally expensive-

Option 1 - Solar Panels. I would recommend a minimum of 100 watts. I am considering 120 watt FOLDABLE Powerfilm. (storing the panels take up a lot of valuable space.
Battery - AGM battery with minimum 100 amp/hr rating.

Option 2 - Install more efficient refrig and consider a DC battery charger. I DC battery charger will also require HEAVY Gauge wire from the Tow Vehicle all the way to the charger. Install switches or pull fuses from the parasitic draws. Use clip mounted fans (like the ones that you would see to defrost bus windshields).

Option 3 - Install 2nd battery. Then you have to find somewhere to mount and TAG already has VERY heavy tongue weight. Even with 2nd battery I don't think summer boondocking will be feasible for more than 2 days, and you still have to find a way to recharge battery quickly.

In the old days my family of 4 would take the Little Guy with a 90 amp hour AGM battery and it would run our 40 qt refrig/ charge our two phones, run a 120 volt power inverter for by wifes CPAP machineat night, for 3-4 days (in upper 70's to mid 80's) with only a 30 watt foldable solar panel adding some charge during the day. (Of course by the 4th day the battery was almost dead, but we still had cold drinks).

In comparison I left Ohio last Thursday at 2:00 pm on a fully charged battery on a 75 degree day, Set up camp in Pennsylvania at 4:30 pm (low 70's) in the shade. Ran 2 reading lights for an hour and the ceiling fan for 15 minutes. Frig ran intermittent as needed. By 8:00 am morning the LOW Voltage switch kicked the fridge off. LEDs and Gas safety switch still worked. By Sunday morning battery continued to drain without and thing being used and Gas Stove could not even light. I am hoping that dealership can find a MAJOR problem or huge parasitic draw, (maybe converter won't shut off???).

TomD

I own a Little Guy Silver Shadow and from the outset (first outing) I had “BATTERY POWER ANXIETY”. I decided after the first year to upgrade to two 6V batteries housed on the tongue. Best Mod I ever did. The Solar doesn’t work for me because we tend to camp with overhead tree canopy. I have a Norcold 60, Fantastic Fan, and Water Pump. The trio sucks power big time. I get three to four days boon docking before I need to move on or fire up the car.

ClarkGriswold

Jason- Have you checked what kind of battery your dealer installed? It sounds like they just put in a “cheap” automotive starting battery rather than a marine type designed for deep discharge. Starting batteries will act like a deep cycle for a while before their capacity rapidly degrades... usually around 9 months to a year.

I will agree that the basic configuration of the T@G is best suited to shore powered RV sites with only a single battery of modest size. I’ll likely remove the propane cylinder, drop down to a 5# or 10#, and move to a side mount behind the rear fender and go the golf cart battery route for those times my solar (90W suitcase for TV fridge and 111W on T@G) isn’t going to cut it and a genny isn’t going to be well received. FWIW, I typically don’t stay put for more than 4 days when off-road (usually two days and on to the next spot).

Michigan_Mike

Energy consumption and knowing the big battery draw items is key to preserving any battery setup. Some very good tips, clues and ideas were noted above as it’s important to know when to shut things down or balance actual energy needs against wants, etc. Solar power is nice, it does help to supplement and offset battery draw when boondocking. I found out early on that I could live without the ceiling fan running, picked and chose when I wanted to watch TV or a DVD and became a believer in the Lucy “rechargeable solar” lights. I also found out that I could unplug my ARB frig before hitting the hay each night and could minimize the draw from my battery. Ryobi makes a very efficient and effective 18V fan if you happen to use their battery operated tools. We use them in Arizona and they are easily recharged off of solar, via an inverter. We have two in Arizona and two in Michigan.

There is a learning curve that occurs over time and if you sort through the wealth of information above and within the forum area itself, you will be better for it and able to extend the life of any battery.

JamesDow

I utilize a Schumacher Model: SC-6000A-CA battery charger, which charges and maintains my battery, along with Renogy 100 watt suitcase solar system. The charger draws about 24 watts max when charging. This small charger does the trick well and I bring it with me when I camp. The converter on the trailer, when plugged into 110 volt power is really not a charger, but a maintainer of the battery(s). Same with when you hare hooked up to a seven pole tow vehicle system (unless you have an extra strong/upgraded alternator). The solar system is also mainly a slow charge back system, maintaining the system. (Check your solar output voltage). I also utilize a700/900 watt Baja inverter - propane generator, which can power the AC and charger the battery at the same time. The generator is $239 at Home Depot and only weighs 26 lbs. I utilize 1lb refilled propane canisters and bought a 5 foot propane hose if I want to run from the trailer propane. Hope my information is of some value.

LuckyJ

@JamesDow I am surprised to here that a 700/900 watt generator can power the AC. I am not gonna say all, since you are now the second person saying that you do not need a 2000 watt gen for this.

How long does it take to recharge the batterie that way with the gen?

LuckyJ

@LuckyJ said:
@JamesDow I am surprised to here that a 700/900 watt generator can power the AC. I am not gonna say all, since you are now the second person saying that you do not need a 2000 watt gen for this.

How long does it take to recharge the batterie that way with the gen?

Ok, @JamesDow I have just saw your answer on an other tread and realized that you are the only one I ever saw reporting this.

But thank you. I will take this into account, will be looking into gens in a few months.

JamesDow

The amount of power for the AC is simple math. 120 volts x 4 amps = 480 watts (measured at 455 watts). Next one needs to add the consumption of the switched AC fan (14 watts peak), the Norcold refrigerator (53 watts) and finally the draw of the converter (14-32 watts). 480+14+53+32=579.

Again keep in mind that the AC actually draws more power as it is on and the compressor is building pressure. This is unlike most electronics which have a startup peak and then drop to a running load.

The load also fluctuates down as the Norcold cycles down and/or the AC thermostat powers the unit down.

If my measurements using my Poniie PN2000 Plug-in Kilowatt Electricity Usage Monitor Electrical Power Consumption Watt Meter Tester are accurate, then with everything on and at max power, the trailer draw is in the range of 670 watts.

Note, I have a 2018 T@G and other models may have some different electronics. Power draw (Amps) on the AC is on the left side. Mine is 4.0A (5,000 Buh)

As for charging the battery, my charger is automatic and moves from charging mode to trickle maintenance mode. The charging, depending on how far it has been exhausted typically may be in the range of 2-4 hours.

For me, I will run the generator for the charger, Norcold refrigerator and my projector (watch movies outside - projected on the back of the trailer or a sheet). When the movies are done and I go in, the batter is charged.

I also use during the day a 100 watt Renogy suitcase setup to maintain the battery throughout the day.