Galley Latches (problem)

Kenji

The galley latch mechanism is repeatedly coming loose. Today the galley door popped up on I-44 coming into St. Louis in a severe thunderstorm. I have repeatedly secured the latches to the pegs (2 mm Allen Key). Mechanism seems poorly designed. Am I the only one this happening to? Anyone know of a fix?

Kenji

found this thread from 2014:

https://littleguy.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/2702/ss-galley-latches-not-securing

LuckyJ

It as happen to others, but not that frequently co pare to the number of T@Gs outhere and owners of the different forums and facebook page.

Not funny for sure.

Use locktite to jam the set screws.

WilliamA

I have done a lot of experiments with the galley latches on my 2017 T@G. While I have not had problems with the hatch opening "in flight", I did have one side that I could open without unlatching so I was curious about the mechanisms and how to make them more secure. In my testing, I found at least 2 potential problems with the O.E. Latches.

First problem, on my trailer, the latches barely would catch the fixed catch. To check this, I took a sharpie and blacked out the metal surfaces of both the latch "tongue" and the fixed hasp on the trailer floor. Then I closed and latched/unlatched the handles several times. I opened the hatch and by carefully examining the contact points, I could see where the latch and hasp were contacting each other. In my case, the right side had much more overlap than the left. The latch was barely contacting the hasp on one side. I fixed that by moving the hasp up 1/4" as many have done.
The second problem was more mysterious and a bit hard to explain but I'll give it a go.

The O.E. latches on my T@G (your latches may be different, but I doubt it) have a 2 piece design. The lock and mount with handle, and the square shaft that protrudes through the door. The square shaft, or "shank" is held onto the latch mechanism by a roll-pin. This is a problem as the design actually allows a good bit of slop between the 2 parts. That means that the more pressure you put on the latch, the more deflection there is between the latch and hasp. In my trailer, it was possible to override the latches simply by pulling up stongly on the handles with the locks engaged. I discovered that under high loading, the shank would deflect enough at the roll pin to allow the latch to slide over the top of the hasp at the bottom. This is, in my humble opinion, a doofus design. The only thing that keeps the latch and hasp engaged is the contact between the shank and the hole on the inside of the trailer lid as it goes through. If there's much play on the inside, it will, under pressure, slide past the hasp.

While I elected to replace my latches for different reasons (Look here for the explanation:)
https://teardrop-trailers.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/674/replacing-my-kitchen-hatch-locks-and-handles#latest

the fix I did results in solving both of the problems by default. By replacing the handles with a lock that has a longer, one piece shank, it eliminates the functional "hinge" in the shank and therefore eliminates the wobble and play at the latch.

If you look closely at the shank in this photo, you can see the roll pin that attaches the 2 pieces together. There is a lot of play at this point and any pressure at that point cause offset of the shank, reducing the amount of overlap between the latch and the hasp.

You can see the small amount of scrub where the latch overlaps the hasp. Any deflection of the shank will dramatically reduce this overlap. If there's not much to start with, it will quickly override the hasp allowing release of the door. This photo is actually of the latch that was catching the most on my trailer. The other one was much less.

If you look where the shank passes through the inside of the door, that point acts as a "bearing" of sorts keeping things in alignment. If the hole is too big or there's any wear, the problems I describe above will quickly get worse.

This is the one piece latch/lock that I replaced the stock latches with. In addition to not having a "joint" in the middle, I also installed the plates shown here on the inside of the hatch so there is no chance of additional wear and movement of the inside of the latch against the door.

Here's a detail of the inside plates. The nutserts fit tightly into drilled holes on the inside of the door so there's no apparent movement now. If you are wondering why I didn't put the big nut for the lock on the inside plate, Here's the reason: In the event of "catastrophic loss of the galley key", as in, "I dropped my trailer keys in the river and now am locked out", I wanted to be able to get into the kitchen by some other means. By putting the nut on the lock against the outside mount plate, I can now, with a bit of fiddling, take the screws out of the lock plate mount, get some wiggle room and then turn the entire assembly without a key. It's a bit less secure, but if someone is that determined to get at my stash of Starburst and dried hash browns, it's a risk I'm willing to take. If need be, I can pick the locks on the doors, but the hatch locks have a good bit of tension and would be hard to turn. So for you burglers out there hoping to get at my Fruit Chews and salt/pepper shakers, that's how you can do it.

I had some trepidations about the flat "tongue" latch as opposed to the cast aluminum piece on the stock latch, but the new latch tongues are steel and quite beefy. I had to bend them slightly to get just the right fit and bending them proved to be something of a chore. I ended up using two vice-grips to properly bend them to fit where I wanted.

It's also important to note that it's possible to get the hatch with the stock O.E. latches too tight! If they are too tight, as in, you have to knee the hatch to close the latches, then the chance that they will deflect and override the hasps is actually increased. On my trailer, I adjusted the latches so when I closed the hatch, I needed add only a tiny bit of extra pressure to turn the locks to the closed position. The seals are actually very nice and engage well, so one doesn't need a lot of extra pressure to keep the environment out once locked. Too much and you risk all of the aforementioned problems...

One more thing:
For those using the stock latches, Locktite comes in lots of flavors from hand-grenade solid to merely mushy. I highly recommend getting some locktite on the allen screws that hold the latches to the shank. They will otherwise loosen over time. Don't use the Harley Davidson grade red stuff. Get some blue locktite and that will hold them, but still allow ease of removal and adjustment when that becomes necessary.
WilliamA

ClarkGriswold

Another option for pinning the stock latches in place is to do the marker/sharpie trick as described above by William except for the latch itself to find where the grub screw contacts the shaft. Once you now this point, drill a hole slightly larger than the grub screw about 1-2mm deep.

Kenji

Wow! Thanks a bunch for taking the time and effort! we are still on the road with bungees securing the handles to the stabilizers. making a decent reply while in the car is somewhat difficult I hope to be able to reply more fully upon our return home.

LuckyJ

If you have your phone or a camera, just get a lght in there, set your camera to make a vid and close the hatch and turn the latch, you will see how much grabs when you replay the small vid you just did. You can also mimik the potential play in the handle.

SueG

Standing at the side of I-44 in a thunderstorm trying to secure the latches with huge trucks flying by was pretty intimidating.

LuckyJ

@SueG said:
Standing at the side of I-44 in a thunderstorm trying to secure the latches with huge trucks flying by was pretty intimidating.

i always carry a couple of strap with bender (as well as big tye wraps, ducktape, bailling wires), that would have been a quick and sturdy fix for this. Did you loose anything before you gor tge info that the hatch was open?

SueG

We were in the far right lane and got pulled over right away. Also didn't have a bunch of stuff loose in the back. I don't think we lost anything, including the latches that came off. From now on we will travel with a variety of bungee cords, zip ties, and duct tape.

LuckyJ

@SueG said:
We were in the far right lane and got pulled over right away. Also didn't have a bunch of stuff loose in the back. I don't think we lost anything, including the latches that came off. From now on we will travel with a variety of bungee cords, zip ties, and duct tape.

Great that you were able to get to it quickly!

Zarpa

Thank you for the warning, one of the screw was effectively lossing on my T@G. But very strange size of Allen screw on the original tongue, almost 8 x 32 mechanical size but not, neither metric. Is there anyone who knows what size it is?

Thank you
2018 T@G Max

beaky

simply unscrew the lower latch catch with a #2 square screwdriver, pop a couple washers in and reattach it, works great, takes 5 minutes

Zarpa

I didn't found a spare screw but I found the right Allen key... and the size! It is the 3/32" key... not always in regular Allen kits. The guy at my strange but awesome hardware suggested me to put a drop of BLUE Loctite (or equivalent) around the screw, it should solve the problem of loossing screws. The blue Loctite let the screws to be removable (with a bit more force)... not the red one.

Thank you to everyone and for the maintenance of this forum, very useful!
2018 T@G Max, Québec

P.S. 2019/08/04 update : The size of the locking screws is 10-24 (UNC), 3/16 po in diameter, easier to find than I thought! It does not need to be Allen type to do the job!

HikinMike

The factory latches do leave something to be desired. I had one of mine fall off. Fortunately, it was in the garage. I plan on putting on some blue loctite, but until then, a little duct tape around the bottom of the pin works great.

Kenji

been away for a while. By way of f/u, I simply reattached the clasp using locktite on the screw and between the handle and bar. Thus far things have proven solid, but we still use bungees securing the handles to the stabilizers.