Solar Ready - Which Brand?

nichutchy4

I just purchased a 2020 NuCamp Tag that is “solar ready”. Can anyone tell me which brand plug this is? I’ve read up a bunch and learned that Zamp’s polarity is different than some other brands - so would like to know what I’m getting myself into when ordering.

thanks

tagurit

It is just a standard DC flat connector. If you use any other brand other than Zamp you will have to buy or make an adaptor to attach that brand's wiring. Many use MC4 connectors, some use Anderson plugs, whichever they use you will probably have to reverse the positive and negative as the Zamp is wired opposite of most.

Sharon_is_SAM

That is an SAE connector. As Tagurit suggests - make sure to trace the wiring back to the battery to determine polarity. Is it labeled Zamp?

beaky

Zamp 100w flex panels x 2 for my rig, I'm in SoCal so boondocking indefinately with full charge is no problem

JamesDow

I use Renogy 100 watt Solar Suitcase w/ 20 Amp Voyager Controller. (26 lbs)
I find the key is to have additional Solar Wire Extension (15ft.) to allow movement of the panels to maintain orientation to the sun and out of tree shade, etc.
I also have a Renogy MC4 to SAE Adapter.
The Voyager controller allows for another set of panels if the need arises.
So far, I have not found the need for additional panels.
I secure the suitcase with a 20ft locking cable, which provides some theft deterrence.
Buy directly from Renogy and not Amazon. You can get the same price and maintain the Renogy warranty in the event the product is received damaged in any manner.
I found this out the hard way, when my first Amazon purchased Renogy suitcase received with a cut in the suitcase. Had to return back to Amazon and not considered a Renogy warranty issue. All is well now. Renogy purchased received promptly with no shipping charge.

HikinMike

JamesDow, how does the 100W perform? I was looking at the Renogy 200W. We like to watch a couple of movies in the evening, run the Norcold and fan. From what I see, the 200W should, under optimal conditions, provide enough output to charge the battery and keep the cooler going simultaneously.

JamesDow

I think the 100 watts performs to meet my needs.
For the most part, everything is somewhat dependent on the battery. The Renogy is mainly charging the battery (less the draw on the battery during the day). The 100 watt appears to be able to charge my battery as the battery is powering the Norcold and leave me enough for a few movies in the evening. Typically I do not run the Fan-Tastic Vent fan at night.

The battery I am currently utilizing (Interstate 850281 24DC Group Size Reserve Capacity=140) is similar to what came stock with my T@G.
For the fan, as needed, I often use a 9 inch rechargeable desk fan. With a USB power block, the fan can run all night if needed and not draw from the T@G battery. I may use the vent fan for a short period to push out hot air.
You have to keep in mind, that you will likely need to reposition the solar panels multiple times during the day to obtain maximum charging ability. One solar array is easier to position than two. My one solar suitcase can fit behind my front passenger seat incased in the box it was delivered in. Weighs 26.6 lbs. I could always get another suitcase panel without controller and add to my 20 Amp Voyager controller.
If I did add another 100 watts to my system, I would likely not get a single panel due to the size (42.2x19.6x1.38 vs suitcase style 19.9x27.2x2.8). The thought of flexible panels attached to the trailer is a thought, but during the summer I usually attempt to park the trailer under shade or partial shade when possible.
If I was going to invest further into my system, I might be in the battery.

If I want, I can always add another 100 watt suitcase, or for the same additional weight, I can also just bring my 26 lbs. Baja propane generator. That is how I just went camping. The generator provides the option to charge the battery, run the air conditioner and/or run my projector to show movies on a sheet or off the back of the T@G.
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JamesDow

HikinMike;
Just added some formulas to my measured power usage spreadsheet to determine run time of my components.
Below are some information of my results based off of 12.5 volts.
Reserve capacity of my battery is listed at 140. For this analysis I use 80% of that capacity to determine runtime in hours.
. Norcold 4.388 Amps Runtime 25.53 hrs
. Fan-Tasti Vent Fan (Low) 2.42 Amps 46.2 hrs
. Fan-Tasti Vent Fan (Med) 3.176 Amps 35.27 hrs
. Fan-Tasti Vent Fan (Hi) 4.825 Amps 23.21 hrs
. Jensen TV with Blue-Ray & Hard Drive 2.026 Amps 55.29 hrs
. Jensen Radio (Low volume) .487 Amps 229.9 hrs
. Jensen Radio (Hi volume) 1.758 Amps 63.73 hrs

So what does this tell you?
Not a lot, but it does indicate that if your ran the fan on low and some on medium for say 6 hours within a day and watched TV for say those 6 hours, used the overhead and reading lights with a porch light on for a couple hour and ran the water pump for an hour, you should not have any issues with a fully charged standard deep cycle battery running even up to 2.9 days without a recharge.
For me if I add the Norcold, say running 10 hours that would give me around 1.3
days without a recharge. Naturally if one did not have the ability to recharge, you would assume the usage of various components would be limited.

Since the Norcold cycles on & off and typically one would not be utilizing any components 100% usage would vary. Ambient air temperature and the Norcold setting would also factor in.
It does tell me that with a full charge battery performing as normal my Norcold would have no problem running a full 24 hour period. With the unit cycling on/off that period would be extended.
It also does tell me that running the radio at low volume to maybe keep intruders away would not be a critical factor in terms of battery usage. I already use a separate USB powered audio MP3 unit for that purpose now.

JamesDow

HikinMike;
Please disregard my last post. I believe I had a significant error in my spreadsheet.
My Bad - Sorry.
Maybe it can be removed. -Jim

JamesDow

HikinMike;
Just corrected some formulas to my measured power usage spreadsheet to determine run time of my T@G components.
Below is some information of my results based off of 12.5 volts.
Reserve capacity of my battery (CostCo Interstate 24DC Marine/RV $79) is listed at 140. For this analysis I use 80% of that capacity to determine runtime in hours.
(I would estimate that my battery has the equivalent capacity of about a 50AH Lithium Battery. By no means is my battery as good as a lithium battery, nor will it have the longevity.)

• Norcold 4.388 Amps Runtime 10.64 hrs
• Fan-Tasti Vent Fan (Low) 2.42 Amps 19.28 hrs
• Fan-Tasti Vent Fan (Med) 3.176 Amps 14.69 hrs
• Fan-Tastic Vent Fan (Hi) 4.825 Amps 9.67 hrs
• Jensen TV with Blue-Ray & Hard Drive 2.026 Amps 23.04 hrs
• Jensen Radio (Low volume) .487 Amps 95.79 hrs
• Jensen Radio (Hi volume) 1.758 Amps 26.55 hrs

So what does this tell you?
Not a lot, but it does indicate that if your ran the fan on low and some on medium for say 5 hours within a day and watched TV for say those 5 hours, used the overhead and reading lights with a porch light on for a couple hour and ran the water pump for a half hour, you should not have any issues with a fully charged standard deep cycle battery running even up to 1.6 days without a recharge.

For me if I add the Norcold, say running 8 hours that would give me around .6 days without a recharge.
Naturally if one did not have the ability to recharge, you would assume the usage of various components would be considerably limited.

Since the Norcold cycles on & off and typically one would limit utilization of other components, running time usage would vary. Ambient air temperature and the Norcold setting would also factor in.

It does tell me that with my fully charged battery performing as normal my Norcold should have little problem running a full day.
That is exactly the same as my real life camping experience.

WilliamA

That's about the same as my experience. I can reliably run two days or more with most things on. I.E. norcold, intermittent fan, lights and radio. I don't really pay much attention to my power usage and just check the gauge from time to time.
I CAN say that, as energy usage goes, the largest difference by FAR that I have seen in my own energy consumption has been swapping out the stock ceiling fan for the Maxxfan. My Maxxfan consistently draws .36 amps at 30% speed and is near dead quiet. It's the best money I've spent in the energy department. As to the Norcold, I just turn it on and forget it. It just works.
As I don't use solar and mostly rely on my TV for charging, I don't pay much attention to battery level (grp 27 wet cell) unless I've been in one spot off grid for more than 2 days.
WilliamA

HikinMike

Thanks JamesDow, very helpful. I replaced my dealer delivered 65ah battery with a Trojan SCS150 100ah battery. So, I dont quite have the run time you do but I'll adapt your info. Thanks again.

JamesDow

HikinMike,
With your battery you should get almost twice the runtime that I have.

As for relying on the tow vehicle (TV) for charge, like WilliamA, it's a good plan. My problem is that I have a small car with a small alternator. I also do not have the sophisticated electrical monitoring system (which I envy - maybe some day). I have at times left the TV running to do its best to recharge the T@G.
I often disconnect and reposition the T@G by hand for best location. ■ When I do leave the TV connected and camp, I am always prepared for the time the TV does not want to start. I carry a lightweight portable lithium jump starter. (never had to use it camping) I have used it twice with one of my other vehicles, and it worked great. I just throw it in the trunk and two or three months later it still has the power needed. I recommend. Not only can it jump start a vehicle, it can also recharge other USB things.
.

HikinMike

I have a small unit similar to that as well. I used it to help a fellow motorist. He was driving an F350 with a big diesel engine. When I walked up with my little unit, he didnt believe I would be able to jump start his rig. I had no problem. Those things are a must have.

WilliamA

I can't think of a modern vehicle that has an alternator that's not up to the job of charging an auxiliary battery. Even the smaller alternators are capable of providing 20 amps to the trailer battery without issue. It's arguable that longevity of the alternator could potentially be affected but I doubt even that. If you are trying to charge a bank of giant, deep cycle batteries then all bets are off. For current maintenance of any battery combination that's grossly mismatched from the vehicle battery, that'll stress all but the heaviest duty charging system. Even the best, most advanced charging system is incapable of sorting out the difference in voltage and current requirements of dramatically different battery arrangements. Your vehicle battery is a high discharge/high recharge unit and trailer batteries are quite the opposite. The charging system will only "see" the average voltage of all batteries in a parallel circuit. If the vehicle battery comes up to peak charge quickly but the massive batteries in the trailer are discharged, you'll get your trailer batteries charged (eventually) but at the expense of a dramatically overcharged vehicle battery.

For folks with large and/or multiple batteries in the trailer, the best way is to use a DC to DC charger in the vehicle system. Even that won't prevent vehicle battery overcharging. The ONLY way to minimize that is to either have the capacity of the batteries be approximately the same, or charge the forklift batteries in the trailer from another source.

When you push the automotive envelope, it often

Pushes back.

WilliamA

GigHarborTom

Thank you guys for all of your technical expertise. I am impressed.
I also have a battery pack/ jump start/ mini compressor/light/
It has been my CPAP backup when we are off grid. It was handy at the one nighters at Cabbelas or Bass Pro Shop. It lasts for at least three nights. I was always going to put a 12volt outlet on our previous trailer but --Just another thing to do. Glad to have on the T@G
I have jumped three big and small rigs. I am on my second unit. I get a low cost functional unit from Harbor Freight.
On another note, my 4Runner with tow strap, I carry, has pulled out a Class A Motor home up to her axles from the Mud.

nichutchy4

So I took my new Tag out for its second trip and am still puzzled by the battery performance. I bought a cigarette lighter voltage meter- so I know I started with a full battery (12.6 on the readout) & we hardly used any of the electrical components:

<1 hr fan one day

water pump for hand washing/dishes at sink, being careful not to over do it.

lights inside briefly just before bed.

light in clamshell briefly at night

and my model has the Yeti cooler- no Norcold drawing power.

By the 24 hour mark the battery was already down to 12.1 and midday on the next day nothing worked. Does this seem appropriate to you all?

My only other experience with battery performance is my parents pop-up. They make it 5 days using significantly more electrical each day.

Also- anyone know how to get around the safety feature that makes the stove not work if the battery is dead? I learned from my first trip and brought the camping stove for backup- but it’s still incredibly annoying that no power = no stove.

I appreciate all the help!

tagurit

Assuming your dealer installed the usual group 24 RV/Marine battery, it would have around 80 amp hours of srorage when fully charged, From your description, you used less than 5 amp hours the first day but you did not include the propane shut off solenoid and the sound system (if you have one), but for the battery to have lost 50% of it's charge in 24 hours, I would guess you have a bad battery or a some kind of short.

nichutchy4

Thanks @tagurit that’s helpful info. Trying to decide if I should reach out to the dealership about this issue, and you’ve confirmed my suspicion that something is fishy.

Yes - it’s a group 24 battery.

We did not use the stereo- though I know the clock draws some power.

Not sure how much the solenoid draws, but we weren’t doing a ton of cooking either.

Sharon_is_SAM

Has anyone measured the phantom drain on the TaGs? Is there an LP/CO detector, LED lights always on on the TV and/or audio equipment, the remote on certain ceiling fans will also send out a signal and consume power.

@nichutchy4 - did you rest the battery before measuring the voltage? A battery under load will be transiently lower voltage.

Sharon_is_SAM

Forgot about USB ports.

https://teardrop-trailers.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/1574#Comment_1574

evpeeling

@JamesDow said:
I use Renogy 100 watt Solar Suitcase w/ 20 Amp Voyager Controller. (26 lbs)
I find the key is to have additional Solar Wire Extension (15ft.) to allow movement of the panels to maintain orientation to the sun and out of tree shade, etc.
I also have a Renogy MC4 to SAE Adapter.
The Voyager controller allows for another set of panels if the need arises.

JamesDow, you said you have the 20 Amp Voyager Controller to add extra panels if you need. What else does the controller do? Can you hook up the solar suitcase directly into the solar ready port?

I ask because I see on amazon you can get a Renology 100W rigid panel for ~ $100 so I'm wondering if I need the controller.

Thanks!

JamesDow

evpeeling;
Bottom line, you need a controller.
The solar charge controller does not do much besides regulate the charger between the solar panels and the battery. With the 20A controller that I have, I could add a rigid panel as you found or a Renogy 100 watt monocrystalline foldable solar suitcase w/o controller ($219). Renogy puts things on sale via their web site often, especially at holidays. Maybe look for a special around Labor Day.

Controller

The controller, allows for selection of the type of battery (mine=Flooded)
It regulates and prevents the battery from being overcharged nd tapers off the flow to the battery when near full. This helps with battery longevity. (5 Stage PWM charging: Soft-Start, Bulk, Absorption. Float, and Equalization)
The controller also protection against: reverse polarity at battery connection, reverse current from battery to solar panel protection at night, over-temperature, and over-voltage.
The display will show: Battery Voltage, Charging Current, Charged Capacity (Amp-hour), and Battery Temperature (if external temperature sensor connected).

Because I often desert camp in the summer months, I purchased the Temperature Sensor via amazon for $9.99
To be able to position my solar suitcase in multiple areas around the trailer, to keep it out of the shade, I also purchased two 15 foot solar extension cables ($14.99 each).
Of importance was the purchase of a MC4 to SAE adapter. ($16.99) This is what makes the transition from the solar panels, controller to the T@G SAE port. Without this I would have to hook up with the wire clamps supplied with the solar suitcase.
I also got a MC4 assembly tool ($5.08) for good measure, but it is really not needed.
Note: If you are going to hook up via the T@G SAE, make sure the polarity of the wires to SAE are correct. Mine were reversed.

daveandcorlene

AMAZING posts packed full of useful info! Thank you very much!

evpeeling

@JamesDow Really great information! I think I will also go with the Renogy 100W suitcase and controller. I have a Yeti cooler and don't have a very high energy demand, so it really seems like the perfect option. And THANK YOU for posting the pictures of the products. Before your answer I was looking at the MC4 extender cables and couldn't understand how it would work just with one cable. Makes a lot more sense now!

JamesDow

evpeeling;
A few last thoughts.
I made myself a cable and bought a lock for some minor deterrence to theft. I string it through the handle in the solar suitcase, then through one of the end loops and lock the other loop to the T@G. I made mine about 18 foot long. I noted one at Home Depot for a dog at 20 foot. That would work fine, but you would need to get rid of the metal swivel clips on each side and maybe the solid loop metal frame thing.
This is a minor deterrence, but if someone had no tools, it may stop them.
I have never had any problems whatsoever on any of my many camping trips.
Us campers are usually good folk.
Be cautious moving the panels after in the sun for an extended period. The black frame gets hot.
Tow Vehicle Placement (With the rear seats folded down)
I slide up my passenger front seat, fold forward and with the solar panel in the cardboard box, I insert it standing up behind the seat via the back passenger door. Fold the seat back to normal and slide it back. Leaves room in front for a person or dog and the panel is nice and secure.

Roger

I've had excellent results with the following setup (Your mileage may very).

Renogy 100 Watt 12 Volt High Efficiency Monocrystalline Solar Panel (Compact design, mounted on top of trailer, excellent output).

Renogy Voyager 20A PWM Solar Charge Controller (Waterproof... Enough said).

Renogy 100 Watt 12 Volt Eclipse Solar Suitcase W/O Controller (Useful when parked in shade. Requires a 20' long MC4 to SAE 2-conductor cable from the Solar Suitcase to the above listed Voyager PWM charge controller).

Vmaxtanks Vmaxslr125 AGM Deep Cycle 12v 125ah SLA Solar Rechargeable Battery
(Upgrade from the manufacturers stock battery).

Jackery Portable Power Station Explorer 500, 518Wh Battery Pack (Backup Power)

I should mention I boondock the southwest so sunshine's not much of a problem.

Happy Trails
Roger

Bob297

I have 2 portable suitcase zamp solar 180W & 120W with EMP shields on the controllers. Also have as backup Jackery 1000W with dual 100W solar panels and Goal Zero Yeti 400 lithium—all with EMP shields.

Roger

Bob297

You got'ta love those solar suitcase's but as JamesDow mentioned there's that little matter of theft. I like his deterrent idea of using a Home Depot Everbilt 1/8 in. x 20 ft. Galvanized Dog Run Cable,,, Not theft proof but it will slow the bad guys down.

Happy Trails
Roger